Have any of you ever used...

[SCredneck]

a Pete Jackson gear drive on a 4.3? It's PAST time for a new timing chain on my motor, and I just might be able to get my hand on a PJ gear drive for a even swap for some other stuff I have laying around. Anyone have any experience with one on 4.3? Worth doing??

[Hammer Head]

I know on a SBC they'll throw the knock sensor if they're computer controlled. Problably will happen to a 4.3 as well.. just watch out if that's what you plan.

[SCredneck]

Do you suppose that's due to the noise they create? The sensor "hears" that and can't tell the difference between that and the knock they are "listening" for?

[Mikz86TA]

Yes. They indeed throw a knock code and thus timing is retarded in association of using a 'noisy' gear drive. There are machined 'quiet' drives.

[87wildside]

The quiet ones will still do it from what I've read.

[T Man]

Its the noise and the natural vibration they create. Even the quiet ones do it. The timing chain acts as a sort of silencer. Why not just go with a double roller?

[SCredneck]

b/c I can get the gear drive FREE

[rat]

If it is a ballance shaft engine forget about it. I wouldn't use a gear drive anyhow.

[Jongo88]

It will throw codes. We have tryed it. Just put a chain in it. It's not like its going to give you any power. My timing chain only lasted for 190,000 miles. What a peace of sh*t...

[SCredneck]

I've heard enough...no gears...hafta order the chain...Thanks for the input, guys...ya'll are great!

[12sws27]

what about the belt drives?

[SCredneck]

I'm all ears....enlighten me.

[12sws27]

I'm all ears....enlighten me.
I'm asking every one. I'm curious as to what they think of the timing belt set ups. so I'm all ears and waiting for enlightenment as well.:D

[Mikz86TA]

IMO...Chain. DoubleRoller if availible

[Maximus]

Belts are good for quick track adjustments but a daily driver no.A belt will stretch a whole lot sooner than a chain will.Go double roller and dont look back.The best way to go.

[rabidbandit]

X2....Yup...go double roller. I managed to get a PJ gear drive working on a late model 350 with FI. But you have to machine some clearance (Die Grinder) behind the idlers and to the side of the gears set. She rubs just a touch:) As far as the knock sensor...you can delete it in the programming...or do like I did...drop the sensitivity down a notch in Flash/Scan! It's a fine line because being that's a PWM type sensor...the data will be skewed if you don't re-scale the table for the timming reduction/sensitivity. It's a PITA!
Not worth the trouble in my book:)

Chris

[SCredneck]

Just wondering...do Cloyes' gear sets have the same issues on these engines? Also, don't these engine use the same timing chain set as a SBC? A friend of mine has offered me his Crane double roller set from his small Monte Carlo (he swapped to a BB). His set only has about 800 miles on it.

[rat]

Just wondering...do Cloyes' gear sets have the same issues on these engines? Also, don't these engine use the same timing chain set as a SBC? A friend of mine has offered me his Crane double roller set from his small Monte Carlo (he swapped to a BB). His set only has about 800 miles on it.

Depends on if you have a ballance shaft or not.

[rabidbandit]

On top of the balance shaft issue...then your have the clearance issue.

And yes...most chains will work on both 4.3 V6's and 5.7 V8's with little or no mods...but call the company just for peace of mind. The double roller sets work great...but forgot to meantion that most say they DON'T fit under the stock timing cover...not that's not saying you can't fork over the dough for a 2 or 3-piece cover though:D Edelbrock makes a very tight dual-linked chain unit that's way better than stock that according to them has no slack and uses a billet crank gear. EDL-7801 from Summit...bout $67! Guess it's slim enough to work and looked like a double-roller according to the pic:rolleyes: Werd:cool:

The Link:
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=EDL%2D7801&view=32&N=700+115 (http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=EDL%2D7801&view=32&N=700+115)


Chris

[shipper]

Good information guys. I was thinking about a gear drive too.

[rabidbandit]

Just remember...you have to lose the balance shaft for the Gear Drive, and be prepared to do some grinding!...really up to you!

They're not worth the trouble they will give you, and unless you can reprogram the knock sensor in the PCM...it will throw CEL's all the time, pull loads of ignition timing, and unlock your torque converter (T/M...hate it:rolleyes: ). The install is a pain in the ass:eek:

You'll never need timing accuracy to that degree on your V6 or the majority of 350's unless you plan on racing full-time turning 7k+ on the tach, having a heavily modified valvetrain with loads of rocker ratio, or insane valve spring pressures.

Most folks just want it for the "Blower whine"...believe me...it's not the way to go just for the sound;)

Chris

[rat]

Just remember...you have to lose the balance shaft for the Gear Drive, and be prepared to do some grinding!...really up to you!


You can't just pull the ballance shaft and run non ballance shaft valvetrain components, there are block differences.

You would have to swap to a non ballance shaft block, then you would have to figure out what to do with the crank position sensor that was on the timing cover assuming it is '96+.

[BigTruckDrivah]

Dude, I just had my 4.3(balance shaft motor)apart for a head job. I replaced the timing chain too, when i pulled the cover off I dont see where there would be any room for a double roller without getting a new cover also so I just went with a factory chain and new gears. If the only hi-perfomance part on the engine will be that gear drive and you have to go through all that trouble I wouldnt even bother. As far as price goes, I think the whole kit(chain, gears, gaskets)was like 25$. Just my .02.

[rabidbandit]

You can't just pull the ballance shaft and run non ballance shaft valvetrain components, there are block differences.

You would have to swap to a non ballance shaft block, then you would have to figure out what to do with the crank position sensor that was on the timing cover assuming it is '96+.

I don't remember where it was...but there is a kit for converting the Balance shaft block to Non-Balance shaft...and I think there are a few that have examples on the SyTy forum.

And yes!...Rat...thanks for the heads-up on the Crank sensor...this is the other issue if retaining FI and changing covers...probably could be indexed and mounted...but would be more fun than it's worth as well:)

Here is a pic of a converted balance shaft block for an S.A. Double roller timing set with other goodies from speedomotive:D It can be done...dunno what's involved...never tried to convert one.
4819

Chris

[rat]

That looks like a single to me, and doesn't look like a roller either.

You can remove the ballance shaft, but you leave the lower gear there so everything lines up.

The front journal is moved back to make room for the extra gear. The older cams have a fuel pump lobe. Esentialy on the ballance shaft cams you give up the fuel pump lobe to shorten things up.

Also, for the timing cover you can't install a 350 timing cover, due to different bolt pattern and shape.

[rabidbandit]

LOL!...your right Rat...The pic clearly shows the single timing chain...never looked closely at it. I did check the page on their website under crate motors...they said it was a double roller unit. Maybe they photo-shopped that turkey:rolleyes:

Man...I need some sleep ...I'm definitly not thinking today...BS motors can't use the Small block covers now that you mention it:hypnotize Arrggg...dunno...summit lists covers for both the 1994 and lower 4.3 (Non-BS) and the 5.7 under the same partnumbers...or am I dreaming again???...for some reason my brain said F-Off:)...I'm freakin' beat. Sorry if I confused anyone.

Thanks for chiming in there Rat for the much needed corrections:D

Here the link: (under LongBlock)
http://www.speedomotive.com/ps-149-69-chevy-43l-v-6-street-master.aspx


Chris

[SCredneck]

Most folks just want it for the "Blower whine"...believe me...it's not the way to go just for the sound;)

Chris

I started this thread b/c I was offered this Pete Jackson gear drive as part of swap deal with a friend. I traded a set of Summit rims for a Edelbrock Performer TBI intake, a MSD 6AL, and this gear drive. I have only had two experiences with a gear drive and that was in a small block in a 67 Camaro 18 years ago. I've learned enough from the responses here to realize that it's NOT the way for me to go with this motor. Am very interested in what it would take to make this TBI motor work w/o the balance shaft.

[rabidbandit]

Unfortunatly...never had any experiance in the conversion...maybe Rat can hook ya up...he sounds like he's had more dealings with the balance-shaft motors. Hell...I haven't even open my '02's front cover yet...hehehe...most of my experiance comes from Chevy small block V8's, Ford 302's, and many, many Chevy LS1's. I'm still learnin' too:D

Chris

[rat]

Am very interested in what it would take to make this TBI motor work w/o the balance shaft.

Remove the upper gear, but leave the ballance shaft in there. Otherwise you will have low oil pressure, or you need to plug the lubrication holes up there. This in effect removes the ballance shaft from the rotating assembly.

You still run ballance shaft components though, like cam, and timing set.

I run a Cloyes single roller myself.

[SCredneck]

If I were to remove it and plug the oil holes, how would you recommend to plug them?

[Toypar]

Just get a cloytes/Edelbrock true roller timing chain. They are adjustable to 4 deg retard or advance but edelbrock suggest you rin it straight up at Zero. The stock timing chain runs a 4 deg retard for emissions.